Pawns & Kings – post release reactions & user reviews

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nagpo
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Re: Pawns & Kings – post release reactions & user reviews

Post by nagpo »

anguyen92 wrote: Fri Jan 20, 2023 7:37 pm
nagpo wrote: Fri Jan 20, 2023 7:27 pm
Mr.Vlado wrote: Fri Jan 20, 2023 11:05 am
nagpo wrote: Fri Jan 20, 2023 10:37 am I think some of the riffs and some music is good. But I don't really like the record that much. It's a step back from the last one where they had a new melodic sound that was experimental.

This one is decent but a more straightforward metal record. i really think myles' vocal melodies aren't very good on a lot of songs. And the lyrics aren't great either. AB went from a band where I acould listen to every record 1-4 over and over without getting tired of it. Those are all great records. then I think they hit their first wall in TLH. the nevxt record was good, but pawns was kind of forgettable. Maybe they should take a break. I don't really yearn for new AB music anymore tbh.
And that shows perfectly how much of a matter of taste it all really is. I love Pawns & Kings much more than AB III and Walk the Sky. And I think all of their music is - no matter the taste - still musically way better than most other bands out there.

You think they should take a break because you just seem to like the older records more? I don't really see how one could come to that conclusion tbh.
I don't think they have as much creativity as their old albums. This album has no ear worm. The type of sound doesn't stick with me. same with TLH. WTS was experiment and melodic. Moody. I don't know why they didn't go further down that path. I just think maybe a hiatus or reevaluation could refill some creative juices. But what doesn't help either is having several other bands at the same time. Maybe have a focus on the one band for all your creativity.
Like what does that all mean? I would like to think they felt creatively rewarded writing this album and that they should feel accomplished in writing the big main songs (Fable of the Silent Son, Season of Promise, Last Man Standing, and Pawns & Kings). It just happens that you didn't enjoy it, but that's ok. People can not like stuff.

I just don't like the idea of people suggesting a band should take a break because they didn't enjoy an album and have to use phrases like "lack of creativity" to justify not liking an album.
I disagree on some points you made. I think it is not as creative as the last record. It's a more "common" or "generic" sound; compared to WTS. It's not bad. But the part you bolded and said "what does this even mean?", yeah, it is my opinion on the record. Isin't that what this thread is about? I don't think the songs are as good as the old songs. And I think a solution to that could be to focus on one band. I think writing so many songs maybe wears them out. I've read many times myles saying it's hard to come up ideas for lyrics. The guy is currently in 3 bands.

The album is well executed technically, everything is played well. lack of creativity is a legitimate reason for not liking a record and thinking they should make changes.

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Mr.Vlado
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Re: Pawns & Kings – post release reactions & user reviews

Post by Mr.Vlado »

nagpo wrote: Sat Jan 21, 2023 12:55 am
anguyen92 wrote: Fri Jan 20, 2023 7:37 pm
nagpo wrote: Fri Jan 20, 2023 7:27 pm
Mr.Vlado wrote: Fri Jan 20, 2023 11:05 am
nagpo wrote: Fri Jan 20, 2023 10:37 am I think some of the riffs and some music is good. But I don't really like the record that much. It's a step back from the last one where they had a new melodic sound that was experimental.

This one is decent but a more straightforward metal record. i really think myles' vocal melodies aren't very good on a lot of songs. And the lyrics aren't great either. AB went from a band where I acould listen to every record 1-4 over and over without getting tired of it. Those are all great records. then I think they hit their first wall in TLH. the nevxt record was good, but pawns was kind of forgettable. Maybe they should take a break. I don't really yearn for new AB music anymore tbh.
And that shows perfectly how much of a matter of taste it all really is. I love Pawns & Kings much more than AB III and Walk the Sky. And I think all of their music is - no matter the taste - still musically way better than most other bands out there.

You think they should take a break because you just seem to like the older records more? I don't really see how one could come to that conclusion tbh.
I don't think they have as much creativity as their old albums. This album has no ear worm. The type of sound doesn't stick with me. same with TLH. WTS was experiment and melodic. Moody. I don't know why they didn't go further down that path. I just think maybe a hiatus or reevaluation could refill some creative juices. But what doesn't help either is having several other bands at the same time. Maybe have a focus on the one band for all your creativity.
Like what does that all mean? I would like to think they felt creatively rewarded writing this album and that they should feel accomplished in writing the big main songs (Fable of the Silent Son, Season of Promise, Last Man Standing, and Pawns & Kings). It just happens that you didn't enjoy it, but that's ok. People can not like stuff.

I just don't like the idea of people suggesting a band should take a break because they didn't enjoy an album and have to use phrases like "lack of creativity" to justify not liking an album.
I disagree on some points you made. I think it is not as creative as the last record. It's a more "common" or "generic" sound; compared to WTS. It's not bad. But the part you bolded and said "what does this even mean?", yeah, it is my opinion on the record. Isin't that what this thread is about? I don't think the songs are as good as the old songs. And I think a solution to that could be to focus on one band. I think writing so many songs maybe wears them out. I've read many times myles saying it's hard to come up ideas for lyrics. The guy is currently in 3 bands.

The album is well executed technically, everything is played well. lack of creativity is a legitimate reason for not liking a record and thinking they should make changes.
To have that opinion is - of course - more than fine. I for my part just find it kind of funny that you think they should take a break just because you don't like the new record that much. Now you explained it a bit more and I can at least see where you're coming from.
Still I think from what I read that at least half of the AB fans would disagree that WTS is a better album. What is more generic for you is just a very good album without the elements I didn't like that much on WTS (like synth) and I guess many people would agree. So again, nothing wrong with your opinion, but it just sounded like "the new album is for a fact not as good as the others, I don't like it, they should take a break". ;)

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Re: Pawns & Kings – post release reactions & user reviews

Post by Ubik »

Schulzy wrote: Fri Jan 20, 2023 4:24 pm I was reading through the P&K - Alter Bridge VII thread from the beginning. I'm only on page 20 of over 100. Questions I have now that it's roughly three months since the album release.

1. Are you happy with the total number of songs? Originally there were 14, then 12. We ended up with 10.

2. At what point will there be additional songs released?

3. Have any songs grown on you or fallen in esteem?

4. Do you still agree with the songs poll I created that Holiday is the weakest/least favorite song on the album?

5. Would you describe the album as dark or angry?

6. What song/songs from P&K would you like to see them add to the live setlist or replace?

7. Overall did it meet, exceed, or fail to live up to your expectations?

8. Did they ever release song lyrics in any of the vinyl packages?
Ooh a quiz.

1. I think it's refreshing to get an album from them that leaves you wanting more in terms of runtime. Obviously if the two bonus tracks come out and they slap then you wonder why they didn't get on, but yeah, ten is fine.

2. Like wizards, they will arrive precisely when they mean to.

3. Mmm, I think my initial impressions have pretty much lasted, maybe the title track has more firmly established itself as my favourite on the album.

4. I mean Holiday isn't among my favourites, but Stay is still far and away my least favourite.

5. Not particularly, I'd say it's mid-ranking in their catalogue for those.

6. Season of Promise and Fable are the two that spring to mind. And to be honest they should be adding Walking on the Sky as well, criminal it's never been played (extenuating circumstances, I know).

7. It met, I never expect another Fortress from them and this fits snugly into their discography.

8. N/A as I have no vinyl. Would they be any different from the ones that came with the CD?
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Re: Pawns & Kings – post release reactions & user reviews

Post by Schulzy »

Ubik wrote: Sat Jan 21, 2023 9:32 am Ooh a quiz.

2. Like wizards, they will arrive precisely when they mean to. :lol Does that make me Bilbo Baggins?

8. N/A as I have no vinyl. Would they be any different from the ones that came with the CD? I was more than surprised that my pre-order vinyl copy did not come with a lyric sheet. It had the signed AB sheet. I wondered if any other versions came with one or not. Did the CD have the lyrics printed in the booklet?
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Ubik
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Re: Pawns & Kings – post release reactions & user reviews

Post by Ubik »

Technically Frodo!

Aha, that does seem odd! Yup the CD does, hidden away.
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Re: Pawns & Kings – post release reactions & user reviews

Post by gbruin »

nagpo wrote: Sat Jan 21, 2023 12:55 am
anguyen92 wrote: Fri Jan 20, 2023 7:37 pm
nagpo wrote: Fri Jan 20, 2023 7:27 pm
Mr.Vlado wrote: Fri Jan 20, 2023 11:05 am
nagpo wrote: Fri Jan 20, 2023 10:37 am I think some of the riffs and some music is good. But I don't really like the record that much. It's a step back from the last one where they had a new melodic sound that was experimental.

This one is decent but a more straightforward metal record. i really think myles' vocal melodies aren't very good on a lot of songs. And the lyrics aren't great either. AB went from a band where I acould listen to every record 1-4 over and over without getting tired of it. Those are all great records. then I think they hit their first wall in TLH. the nevxt record was good, but pawns was kind of forgettable. Maybe they should take a break. I don't really yearn for new AB music anymore tbh.
And that shows perfectly how much of a matter of taste it all really is. I love Pawns & Kings much more than AB III and Walk the Sky. And I think all of their music is - no matter the taste - still musically way better than most other bands out there.

You think they should take a break because you just seem to like the older records more? I don't really see how one could come to that conclusion tbh.
I don't think they have as much creativity as their old albums. This album has no ear worm. The type of sound doesn't stick with me. same with TLH. WTS was experiment and melodic. Moody. I don't know why they didn't go further down that path. I just think maybe a hiatus or reevaluation could refill some creative juices. But what doesn't help either is having several other bands at the same time. Maybe have a focus on the one band for all your creativity.
Like what does that all mean? I would like to think they felt creatively rewarded writing this album and that they should feel accomplished in writing the big main songs (Fable of the Silent Son, Season of Promise, Last Man Standing, and Pawns & Kings). It just happens that you didn't enjoy it, but that's ok. People can not like stuff.

I just don't like the idea of people suggesting a band should take a break because they didn't enjoy an album and have to use phrases like "lack of creativity" to justify not liking an album.
I disagree on some points you made. I think it is not as creative as the last record. It's a more "common" or "generic" sound; compared to WTS. It's not bad. But the part you bolded and said "what does this even mean?", yeah, it is my opinion on the record. Isin't that what this thread is about? I don't think the songs are as good as the old songs. And I think a solution to that could be to focus on one band. I think writing so many songs maybe wears them out. I've read many times myles saying it's hard to come up ideas for lyrics. The guy is currently in 3 bands.

The album is well executed technically, everything is played well. lack of creativity is a legitimate reason for not liking a record and thinking they should make changes.
I haven't seen that quote but I'm not surprised. And I imagine the same could be possible with riffs and melodies, and it reinforces something that I have been concerned about for a lot of years now.
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gbruin
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Hahahaha! It's wonderful to see you, bonus tracks!

Post by gbruin »

Schulzy wrote: Sat Jan 21, 2023 10:29 am
Ubik wrote: Sat Jan 21, 2023 9:32 am Ooh a quiz.

2. Like wizards, they will arrive precisely when they mean to. :lol Does that make me Bilbo Baggins?

8. N/A as I have no vinyl. Would they be any different from the ones that came with the CD? I was more than surprised that my pre-order vinyl copy did not come with a lyric sheet. It had the signed AB sheet. I wondered if any other versions came with one or not. Did the CD have the lyrics printed in the booklet?
I think it makes you Frodo.

**edit: I didn't see that Ubik beat me to it. Should not be surprised. Resuming my mediocre existence.... **
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Dan Dando
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Re: Pawns & Kings – post release reactions & user reviews

Post by Dan Dando »

I agree with you, Nagpo, that AB’s newer stuff doesn’t quite have the same magic as the band’s earlier work. Although maybe this would also be the case in an alternative universe where the Slash/Conspirators and Tremonti projects didn’t exist. After all some bands peak earlier than others. In terms of quality, Blackbird and Fortress would be hard albums to top even if all the guys’ eggs were in just the one basket. So it could well be the case that The Last Hero, Walk The Sky and Pawns and Kings are only as decent/solid as they are thanks to the creative energy provided by the switching between projects. Just a thought… :cheers

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Crumbso
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Re: Pawns & Kings – post release reactions & user reviews

Post by Crumbso »

Dan Dando wrote: Sun Jan 22, 2023 2:27 am I agree with you, Nagpo, that AB’s newer stuff doesn’t quite have the same magic as the band’s earlier work. Although maybe this would also be the case in an alternative universe where the Slash/Conspirators and Tremonti projects didn’t exist. After all some bands peak earlier than others. In terms of quality, Blackbird and Fortress would be hard albums to top even if all the guys’ eggs were in just the one basket. So it could well be the case that The Last Hero, Walk The Sky and Pawns and Kings are only as decent/solid as they are thanks to the creative energy provided by the switching between projects. Just a thought… :cheers
Have to agree with you there. There's so much speculation we can do, but ultimately this is the universe we live in and none of us has a crystal ball into the guys' thoughts or experiences.
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Re: Pawns & Kings – post release reactions & user reviews

Post by maximzub »

So during my challenge of only listening to full albums this week, one of the last albums I listened to was Pawns & Kings. Man, the album as a whole has grown on me so much in the last (exactly!) six months. This Is War, Dead Among The Living, Silver Tongue, Stay, Holiday, and Pawns & Kings all made the March edition of my top 100 songs of all time list. Fable Of The Silent Son has grown on me immensely since then, although I personally still rank it in the bottom half of Alter Bridge's discography. So has Sin After Sin. Last Man Standing has fallen a little bit, but that doesn't mean I dislike it at all. Season Of Promise may be the weakest song on the album, but it still has a couple moments where I'm like "Yes!" (the harmonies between Myles and Mark in the second verse, Mark's solo). I think the album sits comfortably in third place among Alter Bridge albums for me. Although, I have yet to listen to Fortress in track order (I will do so in just a couple hours), so we'll see what I think about it then. EDIT: Fortress is still their best album. I will say that I dislike both Lover and Farther Than The Sun more than anything on either Pawns & Kings or my second favorite Alter Bridge album, One Day Remains.

My ranking (7-10 was really hard to put in order):
1. Pawns & Kings
2. This Is War
3. Dead Among The Living
4. Silver Tongue
5. Stay
6. Holiday
7. Fable Of The Silent Son
8. Last Man Standing
9. Sin After Sin
10. Season Of Promise
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Miro
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Re: Pawns & Kings – post release reactions & user reviews

Post by Miro »

Season of Promise still the best song from this album! Such a pity it's overlooked when it comes to live performances :(

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Re: Pawns & Kings – post release reactions & user reviews

Post by VigilantSteve »

Miro wrote: Thu Jun 29, 2023 4:56 am Season of Promise still the best song from this album! Such a pity it's overlooked when it comes to live performances :(
Hard disagree from me. It's the only song on the album that I skip entirely!

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maximzub
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Re: Pawns & Kings – post release reactions & user reviews

Post by maximzub »

I think this album is starting to become the most "to each their own" Alter Bridge album....
I'm in love with somebody...
Found someone who completes me...
I'm in love with somebody...
Oh yeah...
And it's Lzzy Hale!

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Re: but zaz is posting in AB forums so, skip this completely.

Post by zazthespaz »

Miro wrote: Thu Jun 29, 2023 4:56 am Season of Promise still the best song from this album! Such a pity it's overlooked when it comes to live performances :(
Wouldn't say it's the best personally, but I do think it'd make a good live song. Kind of a poppy feel that would bring a new energy I think.
anguyen92 wrote:
Oh well. Deal with it.
gbruin wrote:
Go reread what zaz says

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Re: Pawns & Kings – post release reactions & user reviews

Post by Vaux »

Season of Promise is my favorite from P&K

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Re: Pawns & Kings – post release reactions & user reviews

Post by TenaciousBe »

I feel like such a bad fan, but man, I just have NOT been able to get into this album as a whole. It's strange, because there are a couple of songs (Silver Tongue, Sin After Sin, Stay) that I really, REALLY enjoy, and then there are a bunch that just feel like AI-generated Alter Bridge Songs. Like, they're good songs and all, but I just don't feel that personality about them. I see people fawning over how amazing Fable is, and I'm just like... eh? It feels to me like they're trying too hard to recapture the Blackbird / Cry of Achilles / Calm The Fire "epic" magic, and it just wasn't quite there. Maybe I just need to live with it some more and see if it grows on me, but the album's been out for 9 months now and it's just not doing it for me.

But let me add - this is also how I felt about Tremonti's latest. For the first few months, I'd listen to it but just felt like it was "standard" Tremonti fare (as P&K feels like "standard" AB). It felt like a little bit of a downturn from A Dying Machine which was such a big, awesome, ambitious project where every song felt like a hit - same as I feel with Walk The Sky, being an album without a skippable song and then followed up by more typical AB sound. Both ADM and WTS felt a bit more experimental and that was the thing I loved. But... over time, Marching In Time has grown on me, and I've learned to find the personality in the songs, and can "feel it" more than I used to. Hoping that's what happens with P&K as time goes by.
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Re: Pawns & Kings – post release reactions & user reviews

Post by Blackbird »

So, I recently have created ranked playlists for my favourite bands. Two P&K songs have made it into my top 10: Fable at 3 (behind Blackbird and Words), and Last Man Standing at 6. I don't think the new album could've done much better. Also, Sin After Sin is still the only song that I can't really get into that much, even Holiday has grown on me quite a lot. After the huge disappointment that WTS was for me - I like some songs from that album individually a lot, especially Dying Light, The Bitter End, In The Deep and Clear Horizon, but it absolutely did NOT feel like an AB album, but more like Tremonti and Myles Kennedy songs awkwardly thrown together -, I couldn't be much happier with P&K. :)

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